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<CryArvach> 911 will simply not cut it...
<Herzen> if I lived in the U.S.
<praxis9> Actually, the crime rate is at an all time low.
<Herzen> I'd probably carry concealed
<CryArvach> Ima.. I lived in AZ for 6 years :)
<Nikie> lupine, what if a cop saw the gun..he might want to see a permit..wont he?
<praxis9> Rape is up, though.
<Nikie> yeah
<Nikie> dangerousssssssssss
<Lupine> herzen: even thou violent crime rate in canada is almost twice that of the US?
<redfish> herzen us isnt that dangerous
<Herzen> Lupine, I CAN'T
<CryArvach> praxis9..especially in states with carry laws
<Nikie> lupine, u're kidding...cant be worst than u.s
<Herzen> If i could, I would
<ImaBadBoy> cryarvach: why'd you leave?
<Herzen> Lupine, and that also depends on the area
<Lupine> nikie: oh sure.. but that doesn't happen if you are carrying properly
<CryArvach> Herzen has yet to perfect concealing a tank
<symbio> Depends on where you live in the U.S.
<Lupine> herzen: yea well, that applies anywhere :P
<bud``> Nikie in decent states where govt. treats adults like adults, you can carry your gun in the open down main st.
<symbio> As a whole though, the U.S. isn
<redfish> they should invent portable tanks?
<Nikie> lupine, heard of live by the sword die by the sword
<symbio> Isn't all that bad crime wise
<Lupine> Nikie: Yep. crime is up in many nations, but not in the US
<CryArvach> Imabadboy... state income tax on top of ****ty wages
<Nikie> lupine, i think u.s wins this one..
<ImaBadBoy> well that hasn't changeed
<praxis9> The crime rate is at a 30 year low.
<symbio> Some areas contain more crime then others
<Lupine> Nikie: wee.. heard the saying "better judged by 12, than carried by 6"? In any event, it has already saved my life on 3 occ***ions in my life.
<praxis9> Why? Concealed carry, baby.
<Nikie> hmm
<Nikie> lupine, by owning/carrying a gun, chances are it ll be used..not always to ur advantage
<Herzen> Lupine, well I can't get a conceal and carry license in Canada
<Herzen> its almost impossible
<Herzen> and handguns are illegal anyways
<Herzen> So...
<symbio> If you don't know how to use it, indeed
<Lupine> nikie: yes, I have had to pull my firearm to save my life.
<ImaBadBoy> Nickie... you shoot first ask questions later... you never lose that way
<praxis9> Nikie: Actually, the chances are it will never be used.
<CryArvach> I can't even recall all the times in AZ...when they say the .45 on my hip..they decided to bother someone else
<praxis9> I mean, for self-defense.
<Nikie> lupine, someone robs u..and UR GUN...who do u think gets to use the gun?
<bud``> Nikie my state CO has more guns than people, I'd say your 'chances' theory doesnt quite work out
<Lupine> Herzen: Yep. Isn't it great relying soley on the police?
<praxis9> The chances are rather slim, to say the least, that if you carry a gun it will be used for self-defense.
<Herzen> Lupine, In my area its not bad
<Herzen> but I wouldn't want to live in the cit
<CryArvach> Nikie...the robber may rob someone else not armed instead...better odds
<Lupine> Nikie: I was robbed. If I did not have my firearm, I would have been dead
<Nikie> yes i know
<symbio> Nikie: Thats why when carrying a weapon you *should* be trained on how to use it
<CryArvach> praxis...I agree....BECAUSE YOU HAVE IT
<Lupine> Herzen: Yep, where you live makes a huge difference. Just not being involved in drugs/etc make a dramatic difference
<Herzen> praxis9, just carrying a weapon decreases the chance that it will be used for self-defense
<symbio> And carry it, and safety measures and precautions
<Nikie> lupine, thats a gun he otherwise wouldnt have
<praxis9> Herzen: Yes.
<CryArvach> Herzen...wrong
<Lupine> Nikie: you misunderstood. HE had a gun.
<ImaBadBoy> Nikie: just yesterday two people tried to rob a "Check Cashing" place.... owner had a gun and shot both of the perps.. guy is dead.. his girlfriend accomplice is in critical.... bet they won't do that again
<CryArvach> many times the firearm is not used..simply the fact it is there prevents a crime...one apect the ban-the-guns crowd does not like to acknowledge
<Herzen> CryArvach, thats what I was saying
<praxis9> I remember the day concealed carry became legal in Indiana. In the town I was living in, a 72 year old man shot a carjacker dead.
<Herzen> If you carry a weapon
<Lupine> Cry: Indeed. High lawful gunownership is a wonderful deterent
<Herzen> and a potential attacker spots it
<CryArvach> ImaBadboy...HEAR HEAR!!!
<Herzen> He'll be MUCH less likely to attack you
<CryArvach> Herzen read what Lup|ne typed
<CryArvach> Herzen...yes
<CryArvach> deterrent
<CryArvach> criminals do not like those sorts of odds..
<Lupine> in cities where guns were all-but-banned.. crime rates soared. Obviously, it is not a direct causual relationship.. but its been shown time and time again.
<wmwmwmwmw> Bush should rename his daughters Vagina Bush and ***** Bush and sell them to Huslter Mag
<Herzen> So as I said, carrying a weapon decreases the chance that the weapon will be used for self-defense
<CryArvach> better to rob some liberal
<symbio> I understand the cautious nature involving guns and every day occurences. However (imo) taking the right of people to carry guns for their own safety does not address that issue. It more likely leaves innocent people who would otherwise have a way of defense stranded and without the ability to defend themselves
<CryArvach> Herzen..I apologize then :)
<CryArvach> I understand now what tyou said
<Lupine> symbio: bingo. criminals do not care about the law
<symbio> The cops won't always be there in every circumstance
<ImaBadBoy> wow. that's really mean wmwmwmwmw
<symbio> Sometimes YOU alone will have to do what it takes to defend yourself
<CryArvach> symbio..don't count on the vops
<ImaBadBoy> how would you like it if we talked about your daughters that way
<Lupine> symbio: actually, in almost all times, the cops will not be there.
<TomM--> So after all that playing on words this Republican Admin, with the House and Senate, and two nominations to the SC is imploding. House lead indicted, Senate lead about to follow, scandal in the WH, economy reeling, gas prices soaring, and of course that noble exercise in Iraq. What happened to the noble plans of smaller government, balanced budgets and the end of Politics of personal destruction?
<CryArvach> Ima..what Herzen said could be taken two ways
<CryArvach> **Click**
<TomM--> lol
<*****hell> i don't have daughters, but if you did I'd ***** shake out of here
<symbio> Maybe along some lines there is a better solution/ However, at any rate the solution is surely not disarming the public for those who break the law
<bud``> in english?
<symbio> It's just silly
<CryArvach> the solution is to ARM and Train the public
<bud``> no
<TomM--> Cry dont shoot me! I only gotta few years left...
<CryArvach> the hell with a chicken in every pot...
<bud``> too many road rage type incidents then
<bud``> just leave the law as is, open carry
<ImaBadBoy> Tom: the Republicans are just a bit off track... forgot what got them in power... acting like democrats now
<CryArvach> how about a AK in every house
<praxis9> Canada's murder rate rose 12 percent last year.
<TomM--> Cry couldya maybe give us a wing?
<*****hell> i meant that, "I don't have daughters, but if I did and I was reading what I just typed, I'd ***** shake out of this channel
<Lupine> prax: wow, that $1+billion they spend on gun registration sure seems to be working!
<CryArvach> the VAST majority of firearm owners are law-abiding citizens
<praxis9> Ours? In the land of the gun crazed cowboy? At a 30 year low. And it keeps falling.
<praxis9> Eat that, liberals!
<CryArvach> Lup|ne...are the criminals regging theirs too?
<Lupine> gee.. I dunno P:-)
<CryArvach> DOH!!
<symbio> Why have Americans become so scared in the latest years?
<symbio> I mean, scared to allow the public to own and carry guns?
<L0c0> you're gonna have a bunch of criminals saying they were unjustly convicted b/c the judge was a mmember of the opposite political party...then it'll turn to people saying that too many ofn one party were on the jury and it wasn't a just jury
<Kaliuna> symbio -- teenage gangs
<ImaBadBoy> scared??? of what symbio
<CryArvach> wasn't Miami one of the first places besides VT that had CCW?
<TomM--> symbio have you seen our President speak? :)
<symbio> Or to say something positive in report about the military without being branded as a war mongerer
<CryArvach> L0c0...then... The Star Chamber
<praxis9> Since they basically outlawed private gun ownership in Australia? In six years, the murder rate rose 36 percent.
<Lupine> Montgomery Alabama Mayor: how to deal with looters/criminals post katrina: "I've said it one time. Get a gun and teach our folks how to use them and shoot 'em."
<CryArvach> TomM-- golly gee...not all are verbally eloquent...
<*****hell> Americans are not scared you fool...the polls that say americans are scared are scared...polls have always been scared of all types of ideas and objects that us humans deem completely normal and feel utterly comfortable with
<Lupine> CA: Florida in 1987
<CryArvach> but I have listened to TomM-- speak...GWB does not sound too bad now
<Kaliuna> L0c0 -- I agree with having this particular judge step aside -- and Idon't want a GOP related judge - there are judges who belong to Independent parties who could sit on this...
<CryArvach> yes...1987...
<symbio> I was getting my haircut today and the barber had a naval picture of a destroyer in the water hanging on his wall. He mentioned to me he is taking it down because he has gotten complaints that it promots war
<symbio> Whats the deal with all this PC stuff?
<DrFlip> symbio: what city is this in?
<Lupine> Look, if this judge had to step aside for political reasons with Hutchinson....
<CryArvach> violnt crime dropped 30% if I recall.in one year
<symbio> Richmond. VA
<DrFlip> symbio: wow
<CryArvach> synbio.. Educrats
<symbio> Great shop, but sad action
<CryArvach> the ones that run the sheeple factories
<TomM--> Kal...so if I get pinched for say shoplifting, may I ask my judge what his political affiliation is?
<symbio> It was a picture of a naval vessel rolling through the water, not even a gun firing or anything
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