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<FreeTrade> I also never paid attention to age
<FreeTrade> I paid attention to development.
<Katey> thumb ****ing is a self-soothing activity
<FreeTrade> I let things happen naturally
<FreeTrade> in their own time
<Katey> like rocking one's self
<FreeTrade> I never rushed anything
<occ2> thats why freetrade says, "if there is fluff on the muff, then she is old enough"
<Katey> or attachment to a special object like a toy
<Katey> etc
<RustyFord> i never ****ed my thumb but i used to bite my finger nails down to the nub=/
<FreeTrade> Occ, Gross..
<KoBushi> Though I do remember my first girlfriend when I was in elementry school; my hair was still blonde so I was real young, forget how old
<Katey> occ2, I doubt that. Too many people do it
<FreeTrade> My kids had no special attachments.
<FreeTrade> I did
<Katey> It's just self soothing
<FreeTrade> I had a blanket I cried when my dad said he burned it.
<RustyFord> heh i still do bite my finger nails actually
<Katey> It's really not an indicator of anything
<FreeTrade> I ****ed my thumb I had a blankie. I was very insecure as a child.
<RustyFord> i never had a blankey
<Katey> FreeTrade, I think that even secure kids have "security objects"
<SweetLeaf> my son is still mad at me for throwing his baba in the trash truck heh
<RustyFord> hehe i had a motorcycle=P
<Katey> I've read nothing that suggests a kid's attachment to an object is a sign that they're insecure
<RustyFord> oh my god although!
<RustyFord> I did have my favorite all time Ozzy Osbourne hat
<KoBushi> My sister and I got punished one time; My da dpoored water into our beds before we went to sleep and tolds us when we ****ed up and were living on the streets that's how it'd be.
<RustyFord> it had pins that would be worth 100's of dollars today
<Katey> My daughter had an imaginary friend
<RustyFord> my dad threw the ****er into the trash!
<RustyFord> ***hole
<KoBushi> I don't remember what we did wrong, but it was aparently something to do with not respecting what we had... I certainly remember the punishment though lol
<RustyFord> teh entire hat was covered in Ozzy pins
<JanetB> well I had 3 kids.. to did not **** thumbs or have objects they would not give up.. one had a blanket..
<FreeTrade> My children were never insecure. They were sourrouned by us all the time. Holding them caring for them reading to them, calming them down by talking to them not by hitting them, I broke all the conventioanl rules and so far the experiment is succeeding. I an in the final phase lets see if it goes well ;) And I hope my kids stay close to me after high school and college
<JanetB> they were all raised the same
<SweetLeaf> I got called a ****er a lot when I was young
<FreeTrade> I cant believe my brother.
<FreeTrade> His kids slept on a differnet floor
<RustyFord> Sweetleaf i got called "Fem"
<RustyFord> "fag" wasn't in yet
<RustyFord> hahahah
<FreeTrade> with a ****ing intercom
<FreeTrade> Our kids slept in our bed
<SweetLeaf> my sisters tortured me
<RustyFord> "yououuuu fem!"
<FreeTrade> never had a crib
<RustyFord> hehe my cousins tortured me =/
<Katey> eh. I don't think there's anything wrong with that though, FreeTrade
<FreeTrade> they got milk anytime they wanted it 24 hours a day
<CometBaby> my mother told me that the thing that I did that annoyed her the most, was that I was always cutting my own bangs. And I can see it in my school pictures 2nd & 3rd grades :)
<SweetLeaf> I was youngest
<CometBaby> and big chunk cut out of the middle
<CometBaby> lol
<Katey> Plenty of people grow up sleeping on a different floor of the house than their parents do
<FreeTrade> Katey I am positive thee is. but we have to agree to disagree. Think of nature. in nature animals are nver left uncared for except when they have to go out and get their own meat.. In human tribes it was the same way, Women always held the babies always had contact.
<JanetB> no way my kids would sleep in my bed!!.. they had a b***inette next to me.. till they were old enough for a crib.. but sleep in my bed.. no.. I would have rolled over and smothered them!
<Katey> CometBaby, lol. I tried to "trim" my eyebrows when I was a kid
<RustyFord> you guys want to hear a weird but cool story?
<KoBushi> RustyFord are you going to tell us even if we say no?
<KoBushi> ;)
<FreeTrade> I see the problems developmentally now with children who never got the nurturing they need. The family bed is widely reccomended and we did it because intuitively we knew it was right.
<RustyFord> my cousins played a mean trick on me once where they told me a cherry tomato would taste the same as a one of those marachino cherries
<Katey> FreeTrade, I agree that contact is important. But if a child is comfortable sleeping apart from the parents and it fascillitates everyone getting a good night's sleep then I think it's fine
<Katey> People are often so rigid about this stuff
<RustyFord> up until about 5 years ago i wouldn't eat a tomato
<Katey> every family is different
<RustyFord> now i like them, but i have to be in the mood for them
<Katey> I couldn't sleep with my kids
<Katey> I'd never have gotten a decent night's rest
<KoBushi> supposedly allowing your children to sleep in your bed increases the chance of SIDS
<Katey> raising kids is sort of constant balance between separation and attachment
<Katey> you're always rebalancing that
<FreeTrade> Katey, Kids learn to be comfortable when they are forced. They usually wake up screaming in fear.. with us we are right there, sheltering them, if we wanted *** after they were asleep we snuck off to the living room and did our thing...
<RustyFord> but they gave me that cherry tomato and man, when you are expecting one taste and get another
<Katey> always reevaluating it
<RustyFord> forgetabout it
<Katey> FreeTrade, well, my kids slept in their own beds from infancy. And they did fine. :)
<Katey> They don't wake up screaming in fear
<RustyFord> that was weird too!
<Katey> Being able to get yourself to sleep and comfort yourself are pretty important things to learn to do
<KoBushi> Katey except for when you run into thier room in the middle of the night screaming "I'm going to get you!" ?
<FreeTrade> I had very strong theories on child raising, based on experience and education. People said it would backfire. It wouldnt work. So far my son and I are like best friends.
<Katey> KoBushi, yes.
<Katey> KoBushi, aside from that
<RustyFord> i remember when i was a little kid i would get this weird dream every now and then that someone was drilling into the center of my back
<KoBushi> naturally
<RustyFord> and that **** HURT in my dream
<Katey> FreeTrade, people manage to do both the "family bed" thing and the opposite both with fine results
<Katey> it's just about what works for your family
<RustyFord> i would wake up cold sweat, i never screamed or nothing, my dad always said that I would never come home crying unless something REALLLLLY bad happened hehehe
<FreeTrade> Katey most kids survive. Its their greatest instinct and knack, and at a certain age you can smother them, But My kids are very secure away from me now. I tell them to walk places..
<KoBushi> I've always had dreams about killing people.
<FreeTrade> I give them a lot of independence.
<RustyFord> even though i kind of resent my dad for letting me leave at 15 years old, I wasn't willing to live by his rules and he allowed me to leave
<Katey> FreeTrade, I'm not talking about kids surviving because that's all they could do. I'm talking about both philosophies resulting in perfectly fine, secure kids
<Katey> and that's pretty much what research shows
<RustyFord> i think that was the best thing he ever did
<Katey> both approaches can be fine
<JanetB> FreeTrade.. I have 3 independant, secure.. responsible kids, that have never been in trouble and we are very close.. and they didn't sleep with us :)
<KoBushi> JanetB Micheal Jackson tried that line in court.
<RustyFord> HAHAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHAH
<KoBushi> :P
<RustyFord> that was good
<FreeTrade> My daughter cusses to much which she got from me, and I tell her, Watch your language ;) And she straightens up for 10 seconds. Actually amongst our familie and her friends she has one persona and like all of us outside in the world we have another. I wont cuss in front of people usually unless they do.
<RustyFord> hahaha FT, i learned VERY quick not to swear in front of adults
<RustyFord> *SMACK!*
<FreeTrade> And thats the way it should be.. Take off your mask at home, and put it on when you go out.
<FreeTrade> Rusty no smack but my kids never cuss in front of adults.
<RustyFord> ohh , ok , sticking your middle finger up is not a good idea to your mom or dad
<RustyFord> hehe i hit the floor
<RustyFord> that was the last time i ever did that
<FreeTrade> When I go to give a buisness presentation ? I wear one mask, When I hit the streets in a high crime area, I put on another mask.
<KoBushi> I've cussed in front of my parents ever since I was old enough to know not to do it in front of school officials
<RustyFord> oh man even the slightest disrespect got you fubared in our house
<FreeTrade> This is just the reality of living successfully in this world.
<FreeTrade> and surviving.
<RustyFord> my aunt is VERY VERY catholic
<RustyFord> and very very irish hehehe
<KoBushi> I got in trouble at school one time for saying "truck you" to some kid
<FreeTrade> Rusty, If I cuss, I can not condemn my kids for cussing.
<RustyFord> to this day she scares me
<FreeTrade> Its my fault.
<RustyFord> oh no no no
<FreeTrade> But the important thing is they know not to do it in polite company
<FreeTrade> Thats the key
<FreeTrade> I dont smoke or drink, I dont expect them too.
<RustyFord> the parents can do what they want....
<RustyFord> if you even THINK about it yer toast....
<FreeTrade> I do take prescription meds, and if they fall off a building and almost break their backs they can too.. But they havent fallen fron a house ;)
<RustyFord> although hehehe, when they were getting drunk all the time they would have me make their 7&7's for them and i would slam down the seagrams as fast as i could and then go outside and play hide and seek
<RustyFord> be all stumbling around and stuff, i didn't realise that it was "alcohol"
<RustyFord> i was only like 6-7 years old
<CometBaby> I see excessive cussing in the same light as I do ebonics, for example. It's an intentional corruption of english.
<FreeTrade> But I am never high. Never lose comprehension or my ability to make rational judgements or otherwise.
<tnzr> haha
<tnzr> rusty: I used to do that kind of stuff when I was a kid
<FreeTrade> Comet on Construction sites it is English!
<FreeTrade> hehehe
<CometBaby> lol
<CometBaby> FreeTrade its a bad habit.
<tnzr> I dont see the big deal about using swear words
<FreeTrade> You know who really changed my mind about cussing ?
<FreeTrade> YOu want to know honestly ?
<FreeTrade> A born again christian.
<pymptype> george carlin?
<FreeTrade> HE always said **** this or ****, or something else.
<tnzr> i think we give too much power to words
<FreeTrade> I said if you are so religious why do you cuss
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