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<mykl> by not teaching
<pqdb> you're not familiar with the school vaoucher debate are you
<madsage> i would think that would require less funding atleast
<madsage> yes, i am for vaoucher
<mykl> some schools will "die" because all the parents will want to send their kids to the nicest one
<madsage> but i am no expert on the issue
<pqdb> here in SC there is a group whic wants to make is so a family can get tax credits (against their local school board's budget) so send their kids to private school
<madsage> yes, compitition is good
<madsage> better education
<pqdb> the thing is it's a reimbursement so only ppl who have the cash to float the tuition can use it
<mykl> true but it will bottleneck
<mykl> voucher is not the best thing
<mykl> to many schools are failing..thats the real prob
<pqdb> especially when that money is literally removed from the local budget
<madsage> we have no compitition currently and little accountability for money vs grades
<mykl> vouchers do not take care of that
<pqdb> ah bs
<pqdb> the probglem is politicans and not educators come up with the standards and funding
<mykl> true
<mykl> politicians ****
<pqdb> and so then wackos liek the NEA are considered "educators"
<pqdb> whtn the NEA Is really a PAC
<pqdb> everyoen has their motives
<madsage> yeah the NEA is bad
<mykl> yep
<mykl> school is jus day care these days
<madsage> they are a political group
<pqdb> then if we give too much local control away, and this is another problem, pretty soon science cl*** becomes bible study
<madsage> politisizing education
<pqdb> so it's a tough problem for a large country
<mykl> I did tutoring for one, as an internship...and all the poor kids were in the afterschool tutor group
<mykl> i swear one did not know how to read
<pqdb> I know hs grads who cannot read
<pqdb> it's pretty sorry
<madsage> well the NEA would turn our children into homo***ual socialists
<madsage> heh
<pqdb> there is a hanitor at my wife's school who is functionally illiterate
<mykl> no
<madsage> which is worse
<pqdb> we offer to help but he always has a reason
<panini> hi ke6i
<panini> pqdb: most liberals are
<mykl> the issue of gay marriage should not be cared about, there are bigger issues
<ke6i> Not the 'gay marriage' issue?
<madsage> hah
<ke6i> people are still talking about this?
<ke6i> gay marriage rocks.
<mykl> yea someone said homo***ual socialists
<mykl> haha
<panini> gays are still talking about it
<pqdb> panini: what is a liberal?
<mykl> i think debating it, is dumb, it will be legalized in 10 years
<panini> pqdb: do you want the definition?
<madsage> liberals support homo***ual socialism
<madsage> hah
<Emil^> i think if gay activists wanted results - they would go for something called 'civil unions' or something.... instead of muddying the the water with religion and the concept of marriage
<pqdb> zzzz
<madsage> ok, i'm being sarcastic, i wish
<pqdb> abortion and gay marriage: the mindless opinion maker
<panini> a LIBERAL is someone who: opposes individual liberty (preferring instead to accrue power to the state), who rejects logic, rationality, and absolute morality (subscribing instead to _moral relativism_), and who primarily uses _emotion_ as the basis for forming judgements
<mykl> thats Bush panini
<pqdb> you mean liberals are pro states rights?
<pqdb> that's a new one
<panini> no
<panini> "the state" doesn't mean state's rights
<mykl> so...whats with this CIA thing, any news
<mykl> I am not really following it
<panini> "the state" means the central govt
<ke6i> This is one of those 'definition arguments' isn't it?
<panini> liberals are statists,
<pqdb> so the current govt is conservative then?
<mykl> they are crazy
<panini> they believe that govt is the solution to all problems
<mykl> panini: maybe, but moderate liberals or leftists are more reasonable
<panini> they cannot imagine or even conceive of the possibility of something being done w/o the govt
<mykl> we madsage
<madsage-> ack easynews dumped me
<pqdb> well it seems a bunch of hyperemotional prolifers and gay haters voted this govt in. I'm confused now
<mykl> pbdb: naww, just people who wanted to be safe
<pqdb> so I guess those prolifers are liberal too using your criterion of the rejection of logic and embracng mindless emotional reactions
<Emil^> panini - all these adjetivies.......sadly i head to read back to realize wich party you were talking about
<mykl> I doubt anyone, except a few, went into the voting booth caring about gay marriage
<madsage-> pqdb, i try not to hate anybody
<ke6i> Imo, US politics are just so about nothing.
<pqdb> you got it!
<pqdb> it's all a distraction for the hseeple to think they're oncolved
<TimothyW-> some trans***uals don't like there *** being declared to be homo***ual ***.
<madsage-> even people with other belief systems and ***ual preferances
<mykl> hate is bad
<pqdb> when in reality it's all meaningless
<pqdb> involved*
<mykl> timothy: true
<pqdb> atthe end of the day, it's always about money
<ke6i> Money rocks
<mykl> tha green
<mykl> ya
<madsage-> i could careless what people do behind the privacy of thier own doors infact i fully support that
<ke6i> The more money the better! I love money!. :)
<pqdb> well, poltiics exists to distract the m***es from what's really happening
<mykl> you know people who buy up like crazy...a hybrid Hummer...that would be funny
<ke6i> Most people ignore politics most of the time.
<pqdb> **** liek abortion is only for ppl to get uptight about and have some axe to grind
<ke6i> People are more distracted by Hollywood and sports than politics.
<mykl> ppl take politics in sound bites or whatever
<Emil^> panini if you are against one side cuz 'gov't is the answer to all problems' - what about the other side who also dumps money into the fed?
<ke6i> Oprah Hollywood and Sports.
<mykl> haha
<mykl> sports is okay, but damn people are obsessed with Hollywood
<mykl> just look at Yahoo and CNN's homepage sometime
<mykl> and the news stories
<madsage-> yeah, dont libs realize the top 70% pay 90% of the taxes?
<pqdb> a bunch of crap
<mykl> actually its true
<madsage-> poor people dont
<pqdb> can we save the limbaugh takling point for noontime
<mykl> the IRS published something like that
<Emil^> madsage - i'm not sure on teh speficis on that stat - but i doubt liberals are blind - tho some just ignore the stats
<madsage-> well its true, wether you want to believe it or not
<ke6i> Limbaugh was never as good after the deafness and the addiciton and all that.
<pqdb> the "rich" p*** on the costo f tax liability to their customers
<TimothyW-> Greek Police Arrest Programmer Because People He Met Got Spammed? Techdirt http://techdirt.com/articles/20051027/0025209_F.shtml
<pqdb> it's only as true as the context
<madsage-> in a fair market with compitition you cant.
<madsage-> somebody will undersell you, that is how capitalism works
<pqdb> ahh bs, taxes are part of the cost of doing business
<pqdb> that's why most MNC's have large portions of their companies offshore
<madsage-> to some extent yes i agree
<pqdb> IRS stats are only accurate for money moved inside the country
<Emil^> pqdb - that is part of it, but bad anology - you're missing the big picture and oversimplying
<pqdb> these companies move m***ive amounts of money ouside the country
<mykl> I say lets pay off our debt and say **** off to the rest of the world
<Emil^> if the yen is up and dollar down....if the mark is up and euro's down...if the peso is up and the crona is down - this is why MNC's operate in multiple fields
<madsage-> who are these? most corporations in America dont have outside entities
<pqdb> no, I'm really not missing the bigegr picture. the tax code itself is so demented, the "logic" behind IRS stats are useless and the results worthless
<mykl> flat tax
<Emil^> it's not about taxes..it's about the global economy and which currencies are strong....well that plus a **** load more...you can't over simplify
<pqdb> the IRS says whatever it needs to say
<mykl> and no one who makes under 25k pays
<mykl> thats easier
<pqdb> what
<Emil^> i mean yes! taxes do matter...but it's more complex than that
<madsage-> flat tax would make the poor pay more..
<mykl> thats why you exempt them
<madsage-> and the big money corps pay less
<YYZ> abolish income tax, flat sales tax on all items
<Emil^> look at caterpillar v. kamatusu production
<madsage-> kamatusu has made a better product due to its lesser labor costs
<madsage-> same as toyota and nissan
<YYZ> make the big money corps pay nothing, then put a 10% flat tax on all items
<madsage-> compared to GM and Chrysler and ford
<madsage-> YYZ, i am for less taxes on buisness
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